On Dec 7, 6:05 am, mswdes...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Dec 7, 2:50 am, "Gerard" <ghen_nospam_drik...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > I have relistened to Tjeknavorian's ASV (Brilliant Classics) recording, and in
> > many ways that one is the opposite of your description here. But no 'magic'
> > either.
>
> Michael, please post your comments on the Tjek recordings, as I'm sure
> you'll have something to say about the (to my ears) exotic sound of
> the orchestra. I don't listen to the piece frequently, but I found
> the Tjek recording a delight. But my recommendation shouldn't carry a
> lot of weight.

I ordered that, too (the whole Brilliant box which I think also
contains contibutions by other artists) and I look forward to getting
it - I have never heard an Armenian orchestra. Just looked at their
website. Looks like everybody's name really ends in -yan!

On Dec 7, 3:50 am, "Gerard" <ghen_nospam_drik...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Michael Schaffer wrote:
> > Anyway, the performance itself is very good, but rather prosaic and
> > not very inspired. There is no fairy tale "magic" here. The playing of
> > the orchestra is predictably highly cultivated, polished and sonorous.
>
> I have relistened to Tjeknavorian's ASV (Brilliant Classics) recording, and in
> many ways that one is the opposite of your description here. But no 'magic'
> either.
>
> > But Previn just waves the orchestra through the piece in somewhat slow
> > and unspringy tempi without really making any interesting musical
> > points. I have heard many more "exciting" and musically more
> > interesting recordings.
>
> I'ld like to know which recordings these are.

I am not exactly an expert when it comes to this piece which I like
but am not really that much into, so I don't know if my
recommendations would be really valuable. I never did any comparative
listening of this piece. A few recordings which come to mind and which
I would recommend though are Temirkanov's with the NYP which is rather
weighty, too, but musically more interesting and extremely well played
- I think the bassoon solos in the second movement are the best
bassoon playing I have ever heard! -, then I also like the recording
with Spano and the ASO, it is very meticulously prepared and has a lot
of drive, and I also liked Immerseel'recording on "period
instruments". I am not sure how "authentic" that all is, but the
orchestra sounds good and it is a very musical performance. No big HIP
"revelations" here, but a very well done performance. I think I also
liked Karajan's BP recording, but it has been ages since I last
listened to it. Maazel's with the BP is very good, too, but totally
spoilt by DG's eaxtremely bright and dry "early digital" recording -
exactly the kind of recording I talked about earlier -, so it can not
really be recommended. Good sound is very important for this kind of
piece.
I would actually like to hear Gergiev's recording. I watched a
documentary about him the other day which contained rehearsal clips
with him and his former orchestra in Rotterdam. Yes, I know, it is
hard to picture Gergiev actually rehearse, but he did, and he had some
interesting musical points to make.
I have the other recording with the WP, with Ozawa, and wouldn't mind
relistening to it but it is packed up and out of reach right now.

> I think my favorite remains Kondrashin with the Concertgebouw Orchestra (his
> only 'studio' recording with this orchestra). But I have never really compared
> things (and never heard Markevitch - my "imprinting" in this piece - and Monteux
> since the LP era).
>
> Recently I've heard two movements on radio of Gergiev's recording. That is one I
> really would like to have, once. And maybe Mackerras (on Telarc), based on
> reviews - I've never heard it.

(mswdesign@gmail.com) writes:
> On Dec 7, 2:50=A0am, "Gerard" <ghen_nospam_drik...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> I have relistened to Tjeknavorian's ASV (Brilliant Classics) recording, a=
> nd in
>> many ways that one is the opposite of your description here. But no 'magi=
> c'
>> either.
>
> Michael, please post your comments on the Tjek recordings, as I'm sure
> you'll have something to say about the (to my ears) exotic sound of
> the orchestra. I don't listen to the piece frequently, but I found
> the Tjek recording a delight. But my recommendation shouldn't carry a
> lot of weight.


Considering there are 5 versions or so, I'm surprised nobody has mentioned
Stokowski in this thread. at least not that I noticed. Talk about
Technicolor!

Brendan

On Mon, 8 Dec 2008 10:10:58 +1100, Michael Schaffer wrote
(in article
<162337d9-384d-4de6-a692-3db9949b4765@c1g2000yqg.googlegroups.com>):

> On Dec 7, 3:50 am, "Gerard" <ghen_nospam_drik...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> Michael Schaffer wrote:
>>> Anyway, the performance itself is very good, but rather prosaic and
>>> not very inspired. There is no fairy tale "magic" here. The playing of
>>> the orchestra is predictably highly cultivated, polished and sonorous.
>>
>> I have relistened to Tjeknavorian's ASV (Brilliant Classics) recording, and
>> in
>> many ways that one is the opposite of your description here. But no 'magic'
>> either.
>>
>>> But Previn just waves the orchestra through the piece in somewhat slow
>>> and unspringy tempi without really making any interesting musical
>>> points. I have heard many more "exciting" and musically more
>>> interesting recordings.
>>
>> I'ld like to know which recordings these are.
>
> I am not exactly an expert when it comes to this piece which I like
> but am not really that much into, so I don't know if my
> recommendations would be really valuable. I never did any comparative
> listening of this piece. A few recordings which come to mind and which
> I would recommend though are Temirkanov's with the NYP which is rather
> weighty, too, but musically more interesting and extremely well played
> - I think the bassoon solos in the second movement are the best
> bassoon playing I have ever heard! -, then I also like the recording
> with Spano and the ASO, it is very meticulously prepared and has a lot
> of drive, and I also liked Immerseel'recording on "period
> instruments". I am not sure how "authentic" that all is, but the
> orchestra sounds good and it is a very musical performance. No big HIP
> "revelations" here, but a very well done performance. I think I also
> liked Karajan's BP recording, but it has been ages since I last
> listened to it. Maazel's with the BP is very good, too, but totally
> spoilt by DG's eaxtremely bright and dry "early digital" recording -
> exactly the kind of recording I talked about earlier -, so it can not
> really be recommended. Good sound is very important for this kind of
> piece.
> I would actually like to hear Gergiev's recording. I watched a
> documentary about him the other day which contained rehearsal clips
> with him and his former orchestra in Rotterdam. Yes, I know, it is
> hard to picture Gergiev actually rehearse, but he did, and he had some
> interesting musical points to make.
> I have the other recording with the WP, with Ozawa, and wouldn't mind
> relistening to it but it is packed up and out of reach right now.
>
>> I think my favorite remains Kondrashin with the Concertgebouw Orchestra (his
>> only 'studio' recording with this orchestra). But I have never really
>> compared
>> things (and never heard Markevitch - my "imprinting" in this piece - and
>> Monteux
>> since the LP era).
>>
>> Recently I've heard two movements on radio of Gergiev's recording. That is
>> one I
>> really would like to have, once. And maybe Mackerras (on Telarc), based on
>> reviews - I've never heard it.
>

The Mackerras is fine, and well recorded. Others I like are those by Neeme
Jarvi with the Scottish National Orchestra on Chandos, Ansermet/l'Orchestre
de la Suisse Romande on Decca, and Haitink with the Concertgebouw Orchestra
Amsterdam on Philips. The famous Beecham seems a bit mannered to me, and
Stokowski a bit overdone.

--
Cheers!

Terry

Michael Schaffer wrote:
>
> I am not exactly an expert when it comes to this piece which I like
> but am not really that much into, so I don't know if my
> recommendations would be really valuable.

I think they are. Even if I don't agree with them. But they always have some
extra information.

> I would actually like to hear Gergiev's recording. I watched a
> documentary about him the other day which contained rehearsal clips
> with him and his former orchestra in Rotterdam. Yes, I know, it is
> hard to picture Gergiev actually rehearse, but he did, and he had some
> interesting musical points to make.

I've seen several of those rehearsel clips with Gergiev.
I remember one with the Symphonie Fantastique (in Rotterdam), and I had high
expectations of the recording. But that came with the Wiener Philharmoniker, and
it was not "the same thing".

On Dec 7, 3:10*pm, Michael Schaffer <ms1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Dec 7, 3:50 am, "Gerard" <ghen_nospam_drik...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Michael Schaffer wrote:
> > > Anyway, the performance itself is very good, but rather prosaic and
> > > not very inspired. There is no fairy tale "magic" here. The playing of
> > > the orchestra is predictably highly cultivated, polished and sonorous..
>
> > I have relistened to Tjeknavorian's ASV (Brilliant Classics) recording,and in
> > many ways that one is the opposite of your description here. But no 'magic'
> > either.
>
> > > But Previn just waves the orchestra through the piece in somewhat slow
> > > and unspringy tempi without really making any interesting musical
> > > points. I have heard many more "exciting" and musically more
> > > interesting recordings.
>
> > I'ld like to know which recordings these are.
>
> I am not exactly an expert when it comes to this piece which I like
> but am not really that much into, so I don't know if my
> recommendations would be really valuable. I never did any comparative
> listening of this piece. A few recordings which come to mind and which
> I would recommend though are Temirkanov's with the NYP which is rather
> weighty, too, but musically more interesting and extremely well played
> - I think the bassoon solos in the second movement are the best
> bassoon playing I have ever heard! -, then I also like the recording
> with Spano and the ASO, it is very meticulously prepared and has a lot
> of drive, and I also liked Immerseel'recording on "period
> instruments". I am not sure how "authentic" that all is, but the
> orchestra sounds good and it is a very musical performance. No big HIP
> "revelations" here, but a very well done performance. I think I also
> liked Karajan's BP recording, but it has been ages since I last
> listened to it. Maazel's with the BP is very good, too, but totally
> spoilt by DG's eaxtremely bright and dry "early digital" recording -
> exactly the kind of recording I talked about earlier -, so it can not
> really be recommended. Good sound is very important for this kind of
> piece.
> I would actually like to hear Gergiev's recording. I watched a
> documentary about him the other day which contained rehearsal clips
> with him and his former orchestra in Rotterdam. Yes, I know, it is
> hard to picture Gergiev actually rehearse, but he did, and he had some
> interesting musical points to make.
> I have the other recording with the WP, with Ozawa, and wouldn't mind
> relistening to it but it is packed up and out of reach right now.
>
>
>
> > I think my favorite remains Kondrashin with the Concertgebouw Orchestra(his
> > only 'studio' recording with this orchestra). But I have never really compared
> > things (and never heard Markevitch - my "imprinting" in this piece - and Monteux
> > since the LP era).
>
> > Recently I've heard two movements on radio of Gergiev's recording. Thatis one I
> > really would like to have, once. And maybe Mackerras (on Telarc), basedon
> > reviews - I've never heard it.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

We heard Gergiev play it live with his orchestra about 2 years ago (?)
here in Berkeley, CA. We enjoyed the concert (mostly - for me, the
first two movements went so slowly and they made me so sleepy that I
did not notice the first end and the second begin), and he included
his two usual add-ons, Islamey and Steppes plus Sleeping Beauty Waltz
as the encore. If the recording is like the concert, it is certainly
colorful (even if the first two movements tempi are slow), with but I
cannot say it like it better than Kondrashin or Mackerras on Telarc.
For me, Kondrashin's Concertgebouw recording *is* magic, and Mackerras
is excitement being born. Based on that concert, I decided not to get
the CD.

I also really like Dutoit/Montreal, a wonderful romantic performance,
but the recording is somewhat mellow and not as detailed as Kondrashin
or especially Mackerras, which is spine-tingling in its clarity.
Still, I would not be without it. I also have Ormandy's Sony, and it
is pleasant, but not in the same league.

~ Bruce

On Dec 8, 8:22*am, "Gerard" <ghen_nospam_drik...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Michael Schaffer wrote:
>
> > I am not exactly an expert when it comes to this piece which I like
> > but am not really that much into, so I don't know if my
> > recommendations would be really valuable.
>
> I think they are. Even if I don't agree with them. But they always have some
> extra information.
>
> > I would actually like to hear Gergiev's recording. I watched a
> > documentary about him the other day which contained rehearsal clips
> > with him and his former orchestra in Rotterdam. Yes, I know, it is
> > hard to picture Gergiev actually rehearse, but he did, and he had some
> > interesting musical points to make.
>
> I've seen several of those rehearsel clips with Gergiev.
> I remember one with the Symphonie Fantastique (in Rotterdam), and I had high
> expectations of the recording. But that came with the Wiener Philharmoniker, and
> it was not "the same thing".

FWIW, at the concert we saw in Berkeley, CA, Gergiev conducted with
what appeared to be a toothpick. For me, that was most intriguing
part of the show!

Bruce

On Dec 8, 11:49*am, bpnjensen <bpnjen...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Dec 7, 3:10*pm, Michael Schaffer <ms1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Dec 7, 3:50 am, "Gerard" <ghen_nospam_drik...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > Michael Schaffer wrote:
> > > > Anyway, the performance itself is very good, but rather prosaic and
> > > > not very inspired. There is no fairy tale "magic" here. The playingof
> > > > the orchestra is predictably highly cultivated, polished and sonorous.
>
> > > I have relistened to Tjeknavorian's ASV (Brilliant Classics) recording, and in
> > > many ways that one is the opposite of your description here. But no 'magic'
> > > either.
>
> > > > But Previn just waves the orchestra through the piece in somewhat slow
> > > > and unspringy tempi without really making any interesting musical
> > > > points. I have heard many more "exciting" and musically more
> > > > interesting recordings.
>
> > > I'ld like to know which recordings these are.
>
> > I am not exactly an expert when it comes to this piece which I like
> > but am not really that much into, so I don't know if my
> > recommendations would be really valuable. I never did any comparative
> > listening of this piece. A few recordings which come to mind and which
> > I would recommend though are Temirkanov's with the NYP which is rather
> > weighty, too, but musically more interesting and extremely well played
> > - I think the bassoon solos in the second movement are the best
> > bassoon playing I have ever heard! -, then I also like the recording
> > with Spano and the ASO, it is very meticulously prepared and has a lot
> > of drive, and I also liked Immerseel'recording on "period
> > instruments". I am not sure how "authentic" that all is, but the
> > orchestra sounds good and it is a very musical performance. No big HIP
> > "revelations" here, but a very well done performance. I think I also
> > liked Karajan's BP recording, but it has been ages since I last
> > listened to it. Maazel's with the BP is very good, too, but totally
> > spoilt by DG's eaxtremely bright and dry "early digital" recording -
> > exactly the kind of recording I talked about earlier -, so it can not
> > really be recommended. Good sound is very important for this kind of
> > piece.
> > I would actually like to hear Gergiev's recording. I watched a
> > documentary about him the other day which contained rehearsal clips
> > with him and his former orchestra in Rotterdam. Yes, I know, it is
> > hard to picture Gergiev actually rehearse, but he did, and he had some
> > interesting musical points to make.
> > I have the other recording with the WP, with Ozawa, and wouldn't mind
> > relistening to it but it is packed up and out of reach right now.
>
> > > I think my favorite remains Kondrashin with the Concertgebouw Orchestra (his
> > > only 'studio' recording with this orchestra). But I have never reallycompared
> > > things (and never heard Markevitch - my "imprinting" in this piece - and Monteux
> > > since the LP era).
>
> > > Recently I've heard two movements on radio of Gergiev's recording. That is one I
> > > really would like to have, once. And maybe Mackerras (on Telarc), based on
> > > reviews - I've never heard it.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> We heard Gergiev play it live with his orchestra about 2 years ago (?)
> here in Berkeley, CA. *We enjoyed the concert (mostly - for me, the
> first two movements went so slowly and they made me so sleepy that I
> did not notice the first end and the second begin), and he included
> his two usual add-ons, Islamey and Steppes plus Sleeping Beauty Waltz
> as the encore. *If the recording is like the concert, it is certainly
> colorful (even if the first two movements tempi are slow), with but I
> cannot say it like it better than Kondrashin or Mackerras on Telarc.
> For me, Kondrashin's Concertgebouw recording *is* magic, and Mackerras
> is excitement being born. *Based on that concert, I decided not to get
> the CD.
>
> I also really like Dutoit/Montreal, a wonderful romantic performance,
> but the recording is somewhat mellow and not as detailed as Kondrashin
> or especially Mackerras, which is spine-tingling in its clarity.
> Still, I would not be without it. *I also have Ormandy's Sony, and it
> is pleasant, but not in the same league.
>
> ~ Bruce- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

I might be tempted to try the Mackerras recording, too. What he does
is usually very good and musically interesting.

bpnjensen <bpnjensen@yahoo.com> appears to have caused the following letters
to be typed in news:84c95c9d-5624-4ee9-bf71-8b7a31b4f018
@k36g2000pri.googlegroups.com:

> FWIW, at the concert we saw in Berkeley, CA, Gergiev conducted with
> what appeared to be a toothpick. For me, that was most intriguing
> part of the show!

I once saw a concert in Berkeley where the conductor used a stalk of celery!
It was some amateur chorus, I forget which, doing P.D.Q. Bach's "Seasonings."

--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
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